Spur of the Moment solo:

Man... I have same "problem" as you Method. E.g at todays rehersal i played well, communicated very well with my maties, but when it came to me doing a solo, i don't know what happens, i just go cold...

I find my vocabulary great in terms of playing with others, but it disentegrates when i'm soloing, i get into the same patterns, same ideas, and when i execute hard stuff it doesn't have the same touch as when i'm playing with the rest of the band. I can clearly hear aspects of my own "half-hearted" executions in my solo, and there must be many others than me, getting the same feeling. I really want to achieve this, but the other drummers i hang out with etc. doesn't want to practice up to a level where you can do Weckl solo's etc. I would like to be able to hook up with some of you online so we can work together on this!

You have the chops methodman, we just need to have them into Time with that anoying click!

Get out of the closet you fakers like me, let us work on this together. I think my keyboard player taped a jamsession from rehearsel some weeks ago i'd like to post, to show where I start from. like the letter (A). and we're heading to (B). So we can make Steve Holmes and the rest of HoD proud [img]cool.gif[/img]

Sorry for long post ( Off Topic? ) i just think there are many drummers out here like me with this "Handycap". Let's take soloing serious.

Let's quit the "Groove is more important than solo", It's not that we forget how to groove because we focus on developing our solo-abilities for a while.

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Dazzler, can you point to one phrase where you think I, the drummer has lost track of where the 1/4 pulse is? I may not have chose to convey it, but I knew exactly where it was. To suggest a drummer with no time can get through this solo is ridiculous imo.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Method, please read my post again, in fact I'll post it again here for you:

** Ok, this has been bugging me...
Method, all good and great drummers have one thing in common: they all have a strong, solid sense of time. It therefor strikes me as being pointless in attempting to play or post a piece of music that is clearly intentended to be played in time when the fundamentals aren't there, regardless of the level of difficulty or what 'new music' is placed underneath. If playing this highly technical piece of music is too difficult, then sort your time out first and foremost BEFORE you master the chops. **


......you'll now notice that I never mentioned anything about you not knowing where the quarter note was. I along with the other guys on here recognise 16th note displacements and superimposing dotted crotchets over 4/4 - we've all watched Dave's vids too!

Regarding your second point, it IS possible to get through this solo as far as getting all Dave's licks down, but it is also possible to play his solo out of time, which this was. Clearly.
Also, if you knew that the cowbell was not in time with you, why bother posting this? What was your objective? Why not play us a more simple, spacious and musical solo of your own instead of a badly executed, out of time solo by another drummer?

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Originally posted by n?40:


With Chic Hot (still the same...)
http://s4.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=85...BAE5B4AF17DE38

Peace.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">....

What is your real name, monster? still looking for my jaws below my desktop!

This is a question of interpretation of time, and there are different points of view that can be argued.

N40, the Hanson clip definitely wasn't rushing, but the Chic Hot clip felt a little unsettled to me.

Here's a couple of examples of straight grooves, the first a pop tune which I co-wrote:

Flying Sample

Oakland Stroke (re-post)

>>I said... the cowbell seems to be in everywhere but not in the downbeat.

Amadeus, that's displacement where the '1' becomes the 'and' or 'ah' of the beat etc. It's a good idea to compare the original and my interpretation back to back.

Dazzler, can you point to one phrase where you think I, the drummer has lost track of where the 1/4 pulse is? I may not have chose to convey it, but I knew exactly where it was. To suggest a drummer with no time can get through this solo is ridiculous imo.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ November 03, 2004 12:21 PM: Message edited by: MethodAir ]</font>

This seems like a good opportunity to see where a fun/challenging solo can develop. This version of Spur follows the cowbell a little more, and smoothes out the hit section (a little [img]wink.gif[/img] ), still rough but a work in progress.

Sorry Method, I just don't get what you're trying to say with this. To me it still sounds out of time. I'm not being funny or rude, I just don't get it.
Why not post something a bit more simple with more space, that you can be sure is in time with the click rather than playing something with far too many notes for your own good that is simply out of time. It will make more sense musically and be all the more pleasant to listen to. At the moment, you're filling up everything.
Being able to play in time whether a groove or solo is an absolute must for any drummer as you well know.

Also, could you please address the points I made in my last post. Thanks.

[img]graemlins/clock.gif[/img]

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Originally posted by Dazzler:
[QBWhy not play us a more simple, spacious and musical solo of your own instead of a badly executed, out of time solo by another drummer?[/QB]

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Sorry Daz, have to pull you up on this one. You always say the same thing, 'keep it simple, keep it musical'. In this thread, it is about soloing. Fair comments about keeping it more in time, and I think MA is aware it wasn't perfect. But it was a damn good effort anyway.
[img]smile.gif[/img]

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You always say the same thing, 'keep it simple, keep it musical'. In this thread, it is about soloing.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I understand what you're saying Rudy, but in answer to your point the fundamentals are lacking here and that's an absolutely vital apptitude to play in time. I'm fully aware that this thread is about soloing, but M.A. has chosen to record and play a solo over a vamp and not a free piece of music. He is playing ideas that are intended to be nailed as it were.

My point is this, I'm not having a go at him at all for what he has chosen to do, I'm simply saying that the basics ie TIME needed to be sorted first, BEFORE he launches into Dave Weckl solo's. I couldn't play what he is playing and I certainly wouldn't attempt it as I know that it wouldn't be in time with the click.

So it follows that I am suggesting to him that he plays us something a with more space that he is certain he can execute in time first and foremost.

With regards to simplicity, I don't have a problem with the amounts of notes that one can play as long as they are in time and relate to the click, without being all over the shop. This is intnded to be constructive critisism and not malicious.

[img]smile.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/clock.gif[/img]

I think it's impressive, though, that you took the time to learn an entire Weckl solo. That's tough to do. It does seem a little loose in spots, but with a little more work every thing will lock in a little more.

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If he just played something simple, he wouldn't exactly be stretching himself would he. It's not about what he can do easily. It's about challenging himself to play musical complexities.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I sort of take your point Rudy, but as you are all well aware by now (!!) that my philosophy is about making music. as Roger so rightly said:

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What does mean to have chops and not to know how do them right in place ?
It's useless !!!

.....We drummer cannot be almost right in time, we have to be right in time !!!

....we are the heart of a band !!!

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Listen to the stuff that he posts, he is the most ridiculous player. The African tune that he posted a while back that wanders in and out of 12/8 has been played non stop and is on my iPod along with his latest offering and yet he has the restraint and musicality to play so 'in the pocket' as on his new vocal track. He will use his considerable chops to SERVE THE MUSIC. When it isn't necesarry, he leaves them at home!!

I'm digressing.... with regards to your point Rudy, I would like to know where it is written that you have to stretch yourself in order to make good music. Miles Davis could play 1 or 2 notes and in the correct place, it would mean SO much.

I agree that it is necessary to stretch yourself as you said, but it certainly isn't true that good music or music that comes from the heart has to be on the edge of your abilities. Play solid, phat crotchets on a ride on their own and if you mean it, it will sound killing and in context.

Challenge yourself and your so-called 'musical complexities' in your practice routine on your own, but as soon as you post something on this site for all to hear, you open yourself up to constructive comments. All the chops in the world don't mean anything if they are not IN TIME. The examples that M.A. has posted for us I pressume, were intended for our opinions otherwise he wouldn't have gone to such lenghts to record and post them. Besides, who wants to play with a drummer - or any musician for that matter that fails to play in time or lock in with a click? This is absolutly fundamental and must be addressed BEFORE anything else, including 16th note displacements!!